and besides salafism is dying out, many of them are becoming sufis, this is just a temporary fitna that will vanish, it has happened before with the khawarij, mutazillah, etc.

and it is not sufi vs. salafi, its sunni vs. salafi cause salafis are not sunnis, how can they be when they reject asharism and maturidism?!… sunnism’s heart is these 2 schools of creed, that is what make a sunni a sunni… when all muslims start to see the power of sunni islam then they will leave their sects… this might happen when the saudi wahhabis run out of oil to fund their fitna…hahahaha… but that won’t happen for a while! Imagine if Sunnis had that oil!!!… we be having deen intensives on the moon!

Ismaeel and Reza Ahmed: you both I think are making essentially the main point that uniting on political issues is a more practical approach than a theological one.

My point is that we have to change our expectations about what constitutes unity. We have to admit that we have had problems with takfiri attitudes in the past or at the very least an ill-disguised contempt. This has not by any means been the sole preserve of the Salafis. This could be lessened I belive with the various approaches I indicated but did not spell out in the post. This would aid not hinder dialogue and cooperation of political issues or other matters of common concern.

Ismaeel: My understanding of the Rushdie Affair was that there was not that much co-ordination between the Barelwis, the Jamaat Islami influenced groups, or indeed the Muslim Institute as it then was. Things were relatively orderly until Khomeini issued his fatwa, which put everyone else who hadn’t wanted matters to get that far on to the backfoot.

Additionally we have to consider the long term impact the Rushdie Affair had. It created a Muslim political identity in Britain but it also put into train, over the long term, an increasing disenchantment with multiculturalism and a general distrust of Muslim political action among those in the British establishment. It was a moment of protest where Muslims marched alone and not in alliance with others. That was the single most important poltical fact on the ground: this was not an issue that made sense outside of Muslim circles. This protest was poltically unintelligible. This I would suggest has never been the cause of entended reflection on the community’s part. What kind of politics did or do we as British Muslim wish to engage in?

Wa s-salam, Yahya

I worry about how this unity between Sufi and Salafy is meant to come about. I have over the years noticed a tendancy amongst some Sufi scholars to water down Sufism to make it more acceptable to Salafis and some Salafis adopting again a watered down Sufism which consists only of elements of tazkiyyah. However key issues of Aqeedah continue to divide us: e.g. the definitons of Tawhid and Shirk.

I also have serious reservations about those who under the banner of Sufism and Traditionalism promote their own agendas which are usually secularist and apologetic and use this cloak they are hiding under as a means to attack the Political Islamic groups (i don\’t like this term Islamist). The danger with the later is greater in the sense that many do not seem to be able to distinguish the two — genuine traditionalist scholarship and pseudo-sufism.

There was a time in the not so distant past when all the leaders of the major groupings would met and share the same platform when it came to political issues from the Ayodha Mosque to the Satanic Verses. However when the Gulf War happened and the word out of Saudi was for the Salafis to support KSA that unity was broken even until today.
Out of those meetings was born the Muslim Parliament which doubtless had serious problems especially the dominance of Kalim Siddiqui and the MCB which succeded it had no input from the traditional schools but was rather a gathering of Ikhwanis.

The only real unity we can expect and is ultimatly vital at this time is a political one, the various Islamic political groups are already well on their way to doing this. The bridge now has to be crossed to incorporate the traditionalists who sadly seem to keep quiet when attacks are made on the concept of Khalifa and Shariah or openly attack other Muslims in the public domain.

Welcome to the Carnival of Islam in the West, a collection of reflections and explorations of Islam from the point of view of Muslims in the West, hosted for the first time here at Dean’s World. As of this week Ramadan ha……

I have recently started following your blog and it is good to see some balanced comment on the blogosphere for a change.

I read this piece with interest, and there are certainly some profitable avenues for conciliation between the various groups here in the UK, some of which you have outlined.

One point is that your essay details a rapprochement based on theological grounds, i.e. what should be the Islamic/creed basis for any common understanding and constructive working relationship. However, is there not also a more pragmatic alternative that does not rely on agreement being reached on some impossibly thorny issues?

Namely, there is a strong case for Muslim groups in the UK putting aside their differences and simply working towards common interests, e.g. defending Islam from media attacks, lobbying government, providing a unified front against extremism, etc.

There is an article arguing for this on ummahpulse.com (http://ummahpulse.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=205&Itemid=38), which seems to be in response to the recent attacks on Deobandis in the Times, attacks which many Barelwis are no doubt trying to maximise for their own sectarian reasons.

At the end of the day, the petty opportunism that you alluded to where one group tries to profit from any adverse publicity affecting its rivals has to stop for the sake of all of us. If we can’t stop washing our dirty laundry in public then how can we make progress on more intractable theological issues?

Lookforward to hearing your thoughts.
Reza

Thanks to everyone for their messages of support. The careful fostering of unity is definitely a general good. As I’ve argued this is best pursued by recognising diversity and defining the essential minimum, as the Amman Initiative does.

Shems Noor: Iraq is not the worst humanitarian crisis of the twenty-first century. That bloody mantle is laid upon the deeply tragic conflict that has been going on in the Democratic Republic of Congo. An estimiated 3.8 million people have died since the conflict began there in 1996. It has almost no press coverage and less outside aid than any other conflict.

Asad Khan: I think I have referred to some basic points of departure for a process of greater unity in the piece rather than spelt them out. First is the Amman Initiative, which recognises eight schools of Islamic law (4 Sunni, 2 Shiite, the Zahiris and the Ibadis) and that Sufis and Salafis are true Muslims. In their interpretative methodologies they have more in common than what they differ on. They affirm the five pillars, the six articles of faith and what is by necessity known to be part of religion. The Initiative forbids takfir and its associated violent and unlawful practices. And it states that the eight schools adduce substantial scholarly requirements for issuing a legal opinion. More details can be found at their website.

The second indication is Imam al-Ghazali’s Faysal al-Tafriqa, which set out the intellectual priorities when it comes to understanding why different intepretations emerge and how to define some minimal standard to these processes while avoiding rampant takfir (a problem in Ghazali’s time as in ours).

The third indication are practical measures. Creating bridging mechanisms of dialogue and joining together to promote good works for the benefit of society at large and strengthening Muslim communities as well.

I don’t think these are vague: they are just not spelled out in detail. If you are interested, then you can follow the details up elsewhere.

Kind regards, Yahya

Sidi Yahya,

Thank you for a thoughtful and insightful view on the salafi-sufi debate.

There seems to be too many groups/movements in UK who are fighting for their share of the market in terms of getting followers to their cause, getting access to the media and to get attention of the government.

The post-911 trend is one of, condemn/criticise/ostracise organisation or groups that are either salafi and/or movement orientated (e.g.. MAB, MCB, Jamiat-Islami, HT etc). These attacks from the “sufi” or “traditional” side can be seen from individuals such as Ed Hussain and his ilk’s or the Sufi Council of Britain etc. To me, it now seems that members of the Muslim community has gone from one extreme to another. The main problem with so called traditionalist is that they believe they have a monopoly on Islam as they espouse tasawuf, which is/was one of the main problems with the salafis, who too claim to have a monopoly of Islam by rejecting tasawuf and madhabs. It seems the one needs the other and vice-versa to find a identity and meaning.

The media and to some extent the government has joined this band wagon by allowing air times to extreme salafis and extreme traditionalists. And who can blame them? This is a story that fascinates and frightens the non-Muslim British public.

We must remember that the so called traditionalists are not united themselves, for e.g. look at the Barelvi-Deobandi divide that has and is causing un-necessary strife in a community that has got far bigger problems such as educational under-achievements, drugs, poor housing, employment, etc. There is also the differences between say the “Q-news movement” (is it allowed to use such a phrase???) and the supporters and students of Shayk Muhammad al-Yaqoubi (as was seen on a certain website a while back) or the Murabitoun movement or the the works of Shaykh Nazims supporters and students. To me the worst aspect of the traditional camp must be the Sufi Council of Britain which is working with the neo-conservatives in the US to push a Islam that to me is not Islam but more Zen Buddhism. In a recent TV show their chairman stated that their magazine does not talk anything about issues facing Muslims outside the UK such as in Palestine or Iraq as this might make the youths turn in to militants!!!! This is just utter none-sense. How can we not be concerned about problems that is facing the Ummah especially as the UK is very closely involved in the worst humanitarian disaster of the 21st century: Iraq.

It seems we have a very short memory as in the 19th and early 20th Century, the biggest “terrorist” organisations and individuals for colonialist governments were sufi brotherhoods and sufi shaykhs for e.g. in Dagestan it was the Naqshabandi shaykh Imam Shamil against the Russians, in Algeria, Shaykh Abdul-Qadir against the French, in Libya, it was Omar Mukhthar and the Sanusiya against the Italians, in Palestine it was Shaykh Izzadine Quassem, who WAS a sufi against the British and Zionist. To the colonialists Tariqas and Sufi Shaykhs were the ultimate enemies to the spread of colonialism in their respective lands.That is one of the reason why orientalist, who were supported by Western govt, were working hard to prove that Sufism is not part of Islam to de-legitimise the above said figures and others from the wider Muslim community.

And anyway, one of the things that “traditionalist” forget is that Sufism is NOT for everyone. If it was for everyone then we would have been told this by the Prophet (upon him be peace). We all have to accept and respect this. Imam Rabbani, the great Naqshabandi Sufi shaykh of the Indian sub-continent made this clear in one of his letters when he wrote that one will gain paradise if they follow the shariah even if they don’t practice tasawuf as the shariah is supreme.

Whatever we are, we all must remember that we are united on one level as we are all Muslims. And on the same hand we are different as we are all working towards different goals and objectives. We all are strands that make up the rich tapestry which is beginning to be called “British-Islam”.

The only way to move forward on the tortuous path of a salafi-sufi “unity” is to focus on areas of shared interests and to avoid contradictory steps that add to the wall of mistrust . This has already started with for e.g.. JIMAS working with Q-News.

And I pray Allah unites us all both in the earthly and heavenly realms.